Say anything

This is an open thread, presuming I have any readers left who may want to chat. Apologies about the post below. Talk about Chen Guangcheng’s incredible escape, or the Bo Xilai soap opera or anything else.


Richard Burger is the author of Behind the Red Door: Sex in China, an exploration of China's sexual revolution and its clash with traditional Chinese values.

The Discussion: 117 Comments

We all need to be more precise with specific terms like “asylum”, which Chen has not yet asked for, according to his main conduit to the outside world, Bob Fu. More likely, some kind of medical release or visa to do legal research will be the pretext used to get him out of China and the the US, where he can then seek asylum if he wants to.

Apparently, “asylum” adds insult to the injury to the feeling of the PRC this incident has caused, while other fudges on his status saves a bit of face. Who knew a thuggish cabal could have such tender feelings?

May 4, 2012 @ 7:50 am | Comment

China’s Gini index just hit 0.55, on par with Brazil, and more unequal than Panama, Nicaraugua, and the Congo.

More tinder for the fire… and so many places where the spark could come from.

I always think that the most dangerous time for China would be when the Spring Festival mass migration happens. Masses of migrant workers and semi-rural dwellers crammed together, artificial scarcity of tickets induced by the government, easily visible official corruption, all it would take is one large riot in a major metropolitan area to set shit completely off.

May 4, 2012 @ 10:29 am | Comment

Good lord, I go away for a couple of days, and the hilarity on this thread hasn’t abated yet πŸ˜€ You guys claim that Hidden Harmonies is a nest of hardcore Commie sympathizers, yet, some of the folks here (no need to point out names, it is blatantly obvious to a high school educated teen who you guys are) are smack entrenched right in the other extreme of the spectrum, LOL! The silliness of you folks inspire me to modify the great Deng Xiaoping saying: It doesn’t matter whether a clown makes people laugh the black way or white way…. he still makes people laugh and is still a clown πŸ˜€

Oh, and I am sure since you brilliant bunch of chaps constantly keep up with all the news relating to the CGC drama, then you guys are most definitely aware of this piece of news πŸ˜›

Oh….. so THAT’S how it was done, LOL! No wonder Gary Locke and Hillary Clinton aren’t going around strutting about a human rights victory engineered by the great America on the home ground of their greatest rival and the one country they would love to see regime change happening πŸ˜› I think they got their wrists slapped VERY TIGHTLY by the Commie Scum leadership for daring to treat Beijing like a city in America πŸ˜› But well, nice play there Americans πŸ™‚ We all know you guys can be counted on to pull all sorts of Mission Impossible 3 stuff when it is needed… all the practice squirreling innocent Muslims away to Guantanamo or some black jail in Eastern Europe or the Middle East sure is coming in handy now πŸ˜€ Bush and Cheney must be lauded for their far-thinking policies πŸ™‚

And BTW, I was actually wondering whether in reality, certain elements of the Commie Scum leadership aren’t rubbing their hands in glee at the happening of this American plan, LOL! I mean, if I was a Commie Scum hardliner, I would be amazed at the sheer STUPIDITY of Gary Locke and the American Embassy to invite… nay, bring aboard, a diplomatic and political time-bomb, into the American Embassy just before the talks with China… Now, from the looks of things, the plan is: (i) misfiring mightily with CGC’s constant changes of mind, (ii) embarrassing the American Embassy, the American State Department, and the American President and opening them to attacks from their political opponents; and (iii) gives China / certain Commie Scum the opportunity to give Hillary Clinton and America a tongue-bashing (with words of course, not literally :P) that they (the Americans) cannot defend against, LOL!

Epic πŸ™‚

For lack of thought, and the inability to foresee the consequences, this plan gets an A+ and two thumbs up πŸ™‚ Which is typical of many major American plans (examples including the way Americans invaded Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan and armed the Muhjahedeen) πŸ˜› And for delivering world class entertainment and drama, America has no competition…. *chuckle*

….. except maybe from some folks on this blog site πŸ˜› But yes, go ahead and think I am an imbecile (or worse, as slim kindly points out above) ^_^

May 4, 2012 @ 10:46 am | Comment

btw, nice to see The American Interest also picking up on how Chen’s escape is good for the Chinese statists and bad for the classical liberals–

The hardliners took some heavy blows after Wang Lijun entered the American consulate in Chengdu. They are out for revenge now after Chen’s arrival in our embassy in Beijing. The next few days will tell us whether they will succeed.

May 4, 2012 @ 10:47 am | Comment

They are naturally out for revenge, no matter if they perceive these events as an opportunity or as a crisis, t_co. Looks like a good-cop, bad-cop game to me (the liberal do-gooding Foreign Ministry types here in Beijing saying: “Look what you / Chen have / has done to our good cause”).

As for the chronology, including the deal made under participation of Jerome Cohen, I guess we still have t to find out a lot of things about the past two weeks or so.

But yes, it seems that there has been a change of heart by Chen Guangcheng.

May 4, 2012 @ 12:38 pm | Comment

TE Low, I don’t think you are an imbecile at all. I think you are intelligent, cunning and slick. I also think you are a classic troll. I thought that back in an earlier thread, but wanted to give you a fair chance. That’s not just based on your snide, nasty, mocking, supercilious comments, or on the fact that you disagree with me; I invite disagreement. No, it’s just that you’re a true BSer, and you enjoy derailing the conversation. For proof of your BSing, let’s look at your earlier comment that you sympathized with Chen until he turned to the US for help, and then suddenly you turned against him because the US is such an awful human rights abuser. Whether the US is or isn’t a human rights abuser is irrelevant. It’s that BS about how you were for Chen, but then, in an instant, just because he turned to the US, you completely changed your conviction and turned against him. That’s nonsense. It’s preposterous. Many people overseas who are the victims of human rights abuse turn to the US for help/asylum. Are they all snakes, do they all deserve your contempt, simply because they asked the US for help? You were never on Chen’s side, and anyone reading your last comment knows it. I could go on and further dissect your earlier comments, in this thread and elsewhere, but it isn’t worth it. At this point, after blogging for ten years, I know a troll from a mile away. I don’t believe a single word you say. Not a single word.

May 4, 2012 @ 12:58 pm | Comment

To T-co,
nice link. Of course, it’s a real credit to the CCP system that the “reformers” and the “statists” can engage in their wonderful rendition of wringing-of-the-hands while the people the CCP lords over can barely discuss these issues amongst themselves on the internet.

Once CGC leaves hospital, then we’ll see what’s what.

May 4, 2012 @ 1:03 pm | Comment

You all need to read this excellent article in the Economist. One of the smartest commentaries on Chen, and the implications of his plight for US-China relations, that I’ve seen yet.

May 4, 2012 @ 1:04 pm | Comment

To Richard,
I disagree. I think TE Low is a complete imbecile, and based on his last comment, a rather juvenile one. Never have I seen someone of any redeeming intelligence whatsoever resort to that many emoticons in one comment. He’s even on a lower level than the Merp’s and Red Stars of the world. They at least manage to say something, however misguided and delusional they might be. This dude manages to generate a lengthy post that says nothing. If brevity is a sign of intelligence, he would possess the opposite thereof.

May 4, 2012 @ 1:09 pm | Comment

Particularly enjoyed these netizen comments:

“β€œThis is how America should respond: China, please careful consider your own policy and behavior, protect your own citizens, ensure they truly enjoy the lawful rights of a citizen. Don’t force them to run to other countries for protection.”

Or perhaps the US should apologize…

“β€œAmerican must apologize; there are so many suffering injustice, why don’t they save more?””

May 4, 2012 @ 1:20 pm | Comment

SKC, I don’t think he’s an imbecile, because he came onto this blog sounding serious and not unintelligent. Then, slowly but surely, he showed his true colors, exactly the way Wayne did, at first sounding logical and well informed and suddenly turning hostile and mocking. Sort of like a Trojan horse. That’s not stupid, it’s just sleazy.

Good Netizen comments, btw. This is quickly emerging as the story of the year.

May 4, 2012 @ 1:35 pm | Comment

I had TE Low pegged as a Hidden Harmonizer from the get go. When one is in thrall to irredeemably bad ideas, no amount of intelligence will overcome that.

May 4, 2012 @ 8:12 pm | Comment

The really offensive thing about TE Low is his use of emoticons. #103 is just obscene.

May 5, 2012 @ 3:14 am | Comment

The really offensive thing about TE Low – in my view – is that he gets so much attention.

May 5, 2012 @ 5:46 am | Comment

Slim is correct; neiher Chen nor anyone directly involved in this used the word asylum. It was used by reporters and/or commentators. Slim also pegged it as the latest news is that it now looks like Chen and his family will leave China so he can study abroad.

I would be very wary if I were in China and had been identified as a supporter of Chen’s. Or if the Government viewed me as being connected to any dissident. I would guess they may be getting a little fed up with the media attention being focused on their human rights actions.

May 5, 2012 @ 6:18 am | Comment

I have a psychotic loathing for any commenter who goes into smiley overdrive. Even one of those offensive symbols places one beyond the pale.

May 5, 2012 @ 8:46 am | Comment

Doesn’t it? πŸ™‚

May 6, 2012 @ 3:06 am | Comment

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