Weekend thread

I would say “thank God it’s Friday” but every day is Friday when you’re not working.

______________

Richard Burger is the author of Behind the Red Door: Sex in China, an exploration of China's sexual revolution and its clash with traditional Chinese values.

The Discussion: 286 Comments

The Chinese schoolteacher who raped 23 students has been sentenced to death.

July 29, 2005 @ 7:27 pm | Comment

Hmm. Not really in favor of the death penalty, but if you gotta have it, this may be an appropriate time to use it. Talk about your betrayals of trust. This guy was a worm.

July 29, 2005 @ 8:18 pm | Comment

Agree, I hate the death penalty but there are plenty of times, like this, where I can’t get too upset about it.

Looks like the post above has become the open thread for the night.

July 29, 2005 @ 9:59 pm | Comment

It must be in the water. Ex-official
sentenced to death for corruption

July 29, 2005 @ 10:24 pm | Comment

Yeah, it’s one of those, “Oh, darn, because I’m really against the death penalty” death penalty cases, for me.

July 29, 2005 @ 11:55 pm | Comment

Bolton lies through his teeth; that’s good enough for Little Boy George – he’s in. How depressing. Be prepared for a whole new definition of the word “reform” as Bolton starts to dismantle the UN.

July 29, 2005 @ 11:59 pm | Comment

I dunno. It stinks of a peculiar combination of arrogance and desperation. Bolton isn’t going to have a helluva lot of credibility (not that Bush cares what anyone else thinks).

And you know Bolton is totally implicated in Treasongate.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:06 am | Comment

No question, and he really did tell a bold-faced lie, the kind that typifies this administration. But it won;t matter. It’s the age of Bush. He’ll be rewarded for staying loyal.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:10 am | Comment

I dunno…I’m wondering if the whole thing might be unraveling…it’s beginning to feel a lot like Nixon’s second term, except I think this is even bigger…

July 30, 2005 @ 12:14 am | Comment

Only the prosecutor knows for sure…October could be one hell of a month.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:16 am | Comment

Senate Majority Leader breaks ranks with the President.

July 30, 2005 @ 8:00 am | Comment

Senate Majority Leader Breaks Gas with the President So what else is new?

July 30, 2005 @ 8:18 am | Comment

The Chinese administration as some in the West loves to find the source of all evils outside of the own country. As Aids, SARS, athletes foot and premature ejaculation also corruption is not homemade and the chinese ministry of education is taking action. Read more on my site (please give it a little traffic).

July 30, 2005 @ 9:48 am | Comment

Shulan, I have tried repeatedly to access your site. Alas , Nada Amigo. So it is with a wilted heart that I have watched my Kreator videos over and over and over……

July 30, 2005 @ 10:18 am | Comment

I only prematurely ejaculate with Latinas.

July 30, 2005 @ 10:20 am | Comment

Don’t know what’s wrong. From here I can access it without problems (Nanny alarm perhaps). But here is the link for the original article from Sinhua:
http://tinyurl.com/ae27y

Did you figure out what exactly is your problem with Latinas?

July 30, 2005 @ 10:46 am | Comment

Xena,

It must be all those porn programs blocking your access.

July 30, 2005 @ 10:50 am | Comment

I just assume (perhaps wrongly) that they’re all Vanessa Del Rio.

July 30, 2005 @ 10:51 am | Comment

Trouble in Uzbekistan, as they tell us to get out. This is a good thing, and it demonstrates that in spite of our benefitting from their help, we won’t be silent when we see wanton abuse, torture and murder.

Uzbekistan’s ties with Washington have deteriorated after the Bush administration joined other Western nations in urging an international investigation into the suppression of a May uprising in the eastern Uzbek city of Andijan.

Uzbek government troops fired on protesters in the city after militants seized a prison and a government building. Authorities denied that troops fired on unarmed civilians and said that 187 people died in the unrest; human rights groups put the figure as high as 750.

Uzbekistan’s president, Islam Karimov, who has ruled for 16 years and tolerates no dissent, has blamed the violence on Islamic militants.

He has rejected the demands for an outside inquiry, and, facing Western criticism, has found a strong support in Russia and China. Both of them are wary about the U.S. military presence in the strategic and resource-rich region.

I can’t praise Bush for this because he chose to dance with the devil. But at least he voiced some criticism, however grudghingly. The real criminals here are the other two nations who simply don’t care and are utterly unashamed about their courtship of demons.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:08 am | Comment

Richard

China would rather prefer a corrupt, evil but cooperative (anti-east-turkestan) regime to a liberal, democratic but agressive (with the “help” of US to enclose China) one as neighbor.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:16 am | Comment

I can’t praise Bush for this because he chose to dance with the devil.

Of course you couldn’t. It’s against libreral law to give credit where credit is due when it applies to the Bush Administration.

Face it Richard, you have penis envy of Bush. It’s okay.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:20 am | Comment

Gordon, Bush chose to partner with this guy. I cannot praise him. Bush partnered with Pakistan, too, which is far more of a threat in terms of weapons proiliferation than Iraq could ever be. He talks a good talk about loving freedom, but when it comes down to it he doesn’t give a fuck. No, I have no praise for Bush.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:23 am | Comment

Gordon:
My coleagues and my her at the “Berlin Center for Research on Blogging Liberuls” (BCRBL) all agree -after some serious Freud reading inspired by an English psychologist- on the fact that only women can have penis envy.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:31 am | Comment

Shulan

You are a bit obssessed with reproductive organs sometimes, though not necessarily a bad thing, for …

July 30, 2005 @ 11:37 am | Comment

Yeah my friends also told I have changed in recent time. I blame Freud.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:40 am | Comment

Freud, you mean you read too much?

If so, a good advice might be to practise more.

I wish I could.

July 30, 2005 @ 11:43 am | Comment

Practising… yeah, but then there is the problem with premature ejaculation. For that I blame the CCP. They poisoned my food when I was the last time in a Chinese resaurant. I’m sure.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:01 pm | Comment

What a surpise!

I thought you were a girl.

Sorry about that. It’s your name partly to blame.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:04 pm | Comment

Yeah my name seems a little confusing. I mean this shulan: 树懒.

July 30, 2005 @ 12:09 pm | Comment

Not “ÊçÀ¼”?!

You cheated on me! You…

Back up

July 30, 2005 @ 12:20 pm | Comment

US asked to leave.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4731411.stm

July 30, 2005 @ 2:22 pm | Comment

Notice it was ther Uzbeks who called it off, not our fearless codpiece commander.

July 30, 2005 @ 2:30 pm | Comment

I’m watching Rambo III on BBC Three.

What a irony!

July 30, 2005 @ 4:14 pm | Comment

Sorry, What an irony!

July 30, 2005 @ 4:14 pm | Comment

And Truly Bad Cinema to boot!

July 30, 2005 @ 4:49 pm | Comment

Richard, I am not sure if you’d consider this as the milestone of current new left movement in China.
For the first time since 1980, Chinese government openly disappove the results of an key reform conducted by itself.
The market oriented medical reform has just been rated as a failure. If you read Chinese, go to this website or go to Chinadaily although it’s been tuned down a little there. New policy is on the way. There are some shocking evidences in the report. I wish I could translate it into english. But I am not ESWN or Jing….
Great, I didn’t know the 1st target of new left policy is medical reform…

July 30, 2005 @ 5:17 pm | Comment

What’s this?
Blue light.
What’s it doin?
It’s shining blue.

July 30, 2005 @ 6:06 pm | Comment

What’s that all about?

I keep frustrated by here and there riddles.

Not a bad thing maybe. You don’t know and you don’t get hurt.

July 30, 2005 @ 6:12 pm | Comment

A bedtime call. 01:45.

July 30, 2005 @ 6:45 pm | Comment

Lin, I read about the failure of China’s current medical system; certainly this was no secret. I would like to see a translation of the report, but I know so many horror stories I can’t imagine being surprised.

July 30, 2005 @ 8:55 pm | Comment

My wife’s sister (40 years) old has terminal Liver cancer.We had to bribe the doctor 30,000 yuan to ensure that she would be treated well. No bribe, no pain meds etc…….I love this place.

July 30, 2005 @ 9:18 pm | Comment

How sick can you get – charging an 8-year-old boy with sexual misconduct!? Does an 8-year-old even know what sex is?

July 30, 2005 @ 10:36 pm | Comment

Richard, What are your thought’s on Condoleeza Rice?

July 31, 2005 @ 12:00 am | Comment

Richard, don’t underestimate an 8-year-old.

He might well know what sex is, but not what crime is.

July 31, 2005 @ 2:54 am | Comment

I want to believe in God.

I just haven’t got that spark, which in a missionary’s words all of a sudden made him feel his last 37 years without god was a life without soul.

July 31, 2005 @ 3:25 am | Comment

Re pig-disease, this article appeared in today’s subscription-only scmp:
————————————————–
WHO kept in the dark over outbreak

UN body wants Beijing to reveal crucial ‘day of onset’ details of pig-borne disease

CHAN SIU-SIN

The World Health Organisation will make a formal request to Beijing for information related to the pig-borne disease which has killed 34 people in Sichuan before deciding if it has been spreading, despite more cases of human infection being reported.

Bob Dietz, spokesman of the WHO Western Pacific Regional Office in Manila added that the “day of onset” was information crucial to decide if the disease, caused by the Streptococcus suis bacterium, was spreading across the mainland. “China is not doing that. We see this as an oversight. That’s not to say that it is not being transparent,” Mr Dietz said.

Although the ministry has provided daily updates of the outbreaks in Sichuan, the information has been patchy and inconsistent. It has not included cases in other provinces, such as the one case reported in Chaoan county, Guangdong.

The cities in Sichuan identified with infections are Ziyang, Neijiang, Chengdu, Mianyang, Zigong, Suining, Luzhou, Deyang and Yibin.

Sichuan governor Zhang Zhongwei told a meeting on Friday that the disease was “basically under control” in key affected areas and that the cases were localised and sporadic, according to the Chengdu Business Post.

While the WHO is yet to receive a reply from the mainland government on the offer of help, Mr Dietz said preventive educations messages were important to help control the disease.

“Rather than relying on the science of vaccine, which is important, we still see public health education as the most effective way to control the disease,” Mr Dietz said.
————————————————————–

July 31, 2005 @ 3:52 am | Comment

Also from SCMP:

Human infections in Sichuan: 174
Deaths: 34
Patients in critical condition: 28
Patients recovered: 12

July 31, 2005 @ 3:52 am | Comment

Who can recomend some Japanese English blogs?

Thanks in advance.

July 31, 2005 @ 4:03 am | Comment

A: Hello Bomb? Are you with me?
B: Of course.
A: Are you willing to entertain a few concepts?
B: I am always open to suggestions.
A: Fine. Think about this then�How do you know you exist?
B: Well of course I exist.
A: But how do you KNOW you exist?
B: It is intuitively obvious.
A: Intuition is no proof! What concrete evidence do you have that you exist?
B: Hmmm.. Well� I think, therefore I am.
A: That¹s good! That¹s very good� but how do you know that anything else exists?
B: My sensory apparatus reveals it to me.
A: Ah, right.
B: This is fun!

July 31, 2005 @ 5:21 am | Comment

Today’s scmp: (couldn’t make this up)

Japanese minister rapped over UN bid

AGENCE FRANCE-PRESSE

China yesterday blasted Japanese Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura, who said last week he was confident Japan’s bid to join the UN Security Council would succeed.

Japan has joined forces with Brazil, Germany and India to form a Group of Four (G4) that want permanent seats on an expanded council, a move that could be vetoed by China or other permanent members.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Kong Quan said Mr Machimura’s remarks were “groundless and with ulterior motives”.

“The Chinese side has always believed the G4 framework resolution draft does not care about the interests of most developing countries, especially those of the small and medium-sized countries,” he said.

July 31, 2005 @ 6:23 am | Comment

Re the UN, Japan contributes 19% of the $1.2 billion regular budget plus hundreds of millions of dollars more for peacekeeping and other agencies, not to mention the billions Japan doles out in aid–including to China.

The other four permanent members—Britain, France, Russia and China together pay LESS than Japan. The US is the UN’s biggest donor, paying a whopping 22% of the UN bugdet.

France contributes 6.4%, UK 5.54%, China 1.53 percent, and Russia 1.2 percent. The US, Japan, and Germany contribute a 51.3% of the total UN regular budget.

Errrrr….what right does China have to whinge about anything regarding the UN? The same country that greedily accepts billions of dollars in aid from Japan, the World Bank, UN etc but still finds the cash to launch manned-space rockets (WHOOSH!) and rapidly supply one of the largest militaries in the world—despite the face that it doesn’t have any immediate and huge external threats?

The arrogance is staggering.

Unfortunately, Kong Quan, not everyone is subject to China’s media censorship. We KNOW what’s going on.

July 31, 2005 @ 6:34 am | Comment

martyn,

if i am corrent, your “theory” advocates that those who contribute a big chunk of money to the UN should have a larger share of voice, right?

being the running dog of US, japan is forced to donate a lot of money to UN, but still can not convince its neighbours that it has the right to get a permanent seat.

talking about japanese aid to china, perhaps you forget to mention the japan didn’t pay the war compensation to china. god knows how much is that.

The arrogance is staggering.

July 31, 2005 @ 6:50 am | Comment

“We KNOW what’s going on.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 06:34 AM ”

————

unfortunately martyn DOESN’T know what’s going on.

he intentionally or unintentionally omitted the most important part of why the japanese foreign minister’s comment pissed chinese off -

“Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Kong Quan said this Saturday in Beijing when asked to comment Japanese Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura’s recent remarks in New York that China will not oppose the G-4 proposal eventually. The G-4 includes Brazil, Germany, India and Japan. ”

i have only one word for the japanese foreign minister’s comment – *shameless* (anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)

July 31, 2005 @ 7:02 am | Comment

Unfortunately, Kong Quan, not everyone is subject to China’s media censorship. We KNOW what’s going on.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 06:34 AM

————

LOL

media censorship? who?

July 31, 2005 @ 7:07 am | Comment

Those who pay big chunks should have a bigger voice is not the point I’m making and you know it.

I’m saying that China–with just over a fifth of the world’s population, pays a minscule amount to the UN and contrubutes little to the peacekeeping operations and other agencies. In fact, it is on the receiving end to the tune of billions of a lot of UN aid, such as Aids prevention.

This, despite the fact that China can find the cash to put manned space rockets (WHOOSH!) into orbit—something that was done by other countries 30 years ago AND buy state-of-the-art weapons from it’s former communist partner for an army that does not face any serious external threats.

THEN, it has the arrogance to slap down Japan for even suggesting a UNSC permanent seat. Japan isn’t suggesting that they A-bomb China, it’s simply suggesting that they, along with 3 other countries should be on the UNSC.

That’s the point I’m making.

Re Japan’s war reparations to China. Billions and billions have been paid from Japan to China since 1972. It’s called development aid but we all know that it’s war reparations. Same for South Korea.

Also, most Chinese don’t know about it because their government choose not to tell them.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:07 am | Comment

“Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Kong Quan said this Saturday in Beijing when asked to comment Japanese Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura’s recent remarks in New York that China will not oppose the G-4 proposal eventually. The G-4 includes Brazil, Germany, India and Japan. ”

Bingfeng, only you would see anything controversial in the above statement.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:09 am | Comment

I think if the UN says “no” to Japan more than once, Japan should just say: “fine, then we’ll stop giving 20% of the UN budget, and fall in line with the average contributions.”

It’s absurd. Fine, have some “conditions” detailing how Japan has to admit wrong-doing in the Pacific during WWII – model it after Germany – and find a way to come up with an apology that is acceptable to both sides without fear of more war reparations, but Japan gives too much of its income to be denied much longer. It’s insane.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:19 am | Comment

I have to say that I had to read that quote several times in context to figure out what it meant. Someone should take an English Journalism class over at that news agency.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:24 am | Comment

“…buy state-of-the-art weapons from it’s former communist partner for an army that does not face any serious external threats”

————-

this is the most stupid comment i read in many years time.

US military budget is larger than those of the following 15 countries altogether and you believe US faces a serious external threat?

July 31, 2005 @ 7:36 am | Comment

Exactly Laowai, I read an AP article recently saying that Japan will likely face very strong public pressure to slash the amount of cash it hands over to the UN if it fails to get a UNSC seat.

As with our friend bingfeng’s comments above, talk to the average mainlander about this subject and you might as well talk to one of my three doggies because you get just as much sense from them.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:37 am | Comment

“Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Kong Quan said this Saturday in Beijing when asked to comment Japanese Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura’s recent remarks in New York that China will not oppose the G-4 proposal eventually. The G-4 includes Brazil, Germany, India and Japan. ”

Bingfeng, only you would see anything controversial in the above statement.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 07:09 AM

———————

“China in June vowed to block any move to give permanent seats to the G4 … ”

“Japanese Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura’s recent remarks in New York that China will not oppose the G-4 proposal eventually”

what’s wrong with your eyes, martyn?

you just read what you want to read, right?

July 31, 2005 @ 7:39 am | Comment

That’s right bingfeng, ignore the argument and concentrate on some other remark. China can never do anything wrong in your eyes can it?

Let’s ignore the ins-and-outs of Japan’s UNSC place and talk about nasty America. Nice move but you’re on your own.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:41 am | Comment

what’s the good of japan’s getting a permanent seat? it can’t represent its asian neighbours, it can’t represent europe, it can’t represent south america or africa, it can NOT EVEN represent itself. even its master is pretty reluctant to let it in.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:45 am | Comment

bingfeng, get back in the real world. Your anti-Japan prejudices are clouding your eyes.

Are you seriously saying that Machimura’s diplo-speak which I note used the word EVENTUALLY at the end is so controversial that it deserves an outburst from China’s Foreign Minstry?

It’s diplomatic talk! He’s saying that he hopes and expects that eventually China will be persuaded to support Japan’s application.

Don’t take the hopes of some Japanese political so literally, you are reading way too much into it.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:48 am | Comment

Japan’s UNSC place? No way.

Not until China’s strong enough to counter Japan and US in all aspects in Asia.

And when it comes to China’s foreign policy, I just hope it as hawkish as possilbe, not for aggression but defense.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:49 am | Comment

“That’s right bingfeng, ignore the argument and concentrate on some other remark. China can never do anything wrong in your eyes can it? ”

—————–

china has a lot of wrong-doings as richard’s many posts indicated. i did’t defend china in every thread richard put out which means i agree with his many accusations of china’s wrongdoings

it’s very childish every time you are going to lose your debate, i see comments like this:

- ok, you are always right, china is always right
- no matter what, we are free, you are not
- i am not going to talk with you, most chinese are brainwashed

July 31, 2005 @ 7:50 am | Comment

bingfeng, talking to you about Japan really is like talking to a brick wall. You are so full of hatred. You don’t want Japan to have a UNSC seat because you want Japan to have nothing and you want China to remain Asia’s only UNSC representative. Therefoe, you scratch and scrape, duck and dive, bob and weave, twist and shout (!) for every half-baked excuse you can muster. It’s a pretty sad sight mate.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:52 am | Comment

“You don’t want Japan to have a UNSC seat because you want Japan to have nothing and you want China to remain Asia’s only UNSC representative.”

Totally agree. That’s what I want to. And many other Chinese and Korean.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:54 am | Comment

Great technique bingfeng, pick out one sentence and call me childish. Well done mate.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:55 am | Comment

Ooops, I was referring to this: “That’s right bingfeng, ignore the argument and concentrate on some other remark. China can never do anything wrong in your eyes can it? ”

July 31, 2005 @ 7:55 am | Comment

I tell you something bingfeng mate, I look at you and I think that the patriotic education and the controlled madia have a lot to answer for, I really do.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:57 am | Comment

The point isn’t representation. Russia and China can’t represent Asia and Eastern Europe any more than the US can represent Latin America. The question IS partly about money, since what we term “security” is irrevocably linked to economy, and it also has to do with balance. China gnashing at the bit to push down Japan while China rises needs to be balanced out. Similarly, Brazil should be in so that there is a strong Latin American country to stand up the American influence. Similarly, India is going to be a major player in the world, and should be let in. Similarly, Germany is a bastion of Anti-American sentiment in Europe, and can spearhead better balance in Europe on the security council.

It is absolutely not about representation.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:57 am | Comment

Are you seriously saying that Machimura’s diplo-speak which I note used the word EVENTUALLY at the end is so controversial that it deserves an outburst from China’s Foreign Minstry?

It’s diplomatic talk! He’s saying that he hopes and expects that eventually China will be persuaded to support Japan’s application.

Don’t take the hopes of some Japanese political so literally, you are reading way too much into it.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 07:48 AM

——————-

martyn, i have always a high expectation on a brit’s intelligence power, especially when it comes to international politics

japanese foreign minister is trying a ploy of misleading other countries to favor a forcible voting on the proposal and japan can take advantage from that

obviously the japanese foreign minister lies in front of the whole world by saying that china won’t oppose the g-4 proposal. but as long as it benefits the japanese, they don’t mind lying in front of the whole world. remember the pearl harbor?

i don’t believe you can’t get that.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:59 am | Comment

Do you guys really hate Japanese people that much? It’s really scary.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:59 am | Comment

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B: To explode, of course!
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A: Well then, you¹ve already admitted that you have no real proof of the existence of the outside universe.
B: Yeah, weeellll�.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:06 am | Comment

bingfeng, talking to you about Japan really is like talking to a brick wall. You are so full of hatred. You don’t want Japan to have a UNSC seat because you want Japan to have nothing and you want China to remain Asia’s only UNSC representative. Therefoe, you scratch and scrape, duck and dive, bob and weave, twist and shout (!) for every half-baked excuse you can muster. It’s a pretty sad sight mate.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 07:52 AM

I tell you something bingfeng mate, I look at you and I think that the patriotic education and the controlled madia have a lot to answer for, I really do.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 07:57 AM

————

hehe, unfortunately i didn’t have a lot of chances to receive “patriotic education ” in china. speaking of japan, i had many experiences with japanese and japan, and in fact i like japanese history and literature very much, perhaps that’s the reason why we chinese know japanese better than you guys

July 31, 2005 @ 8:07 am | Comment

Japan / Russia, great countries, great threats and strategic enemies to China.

In terms of the idea of balance, I don’t like that, nor do US, Japan, Russia or others.

Everyone wants others to be balanced but not itself.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:08 am | Comment

bingfeng

C’mon man, China have the power to veto this G4 application and the Japanese foreign minister knows this. Even the US have spoken of a “broad consensus” being in place before the G4 application can be seriously consdiered.

On top of that, countries that aren’t as powerful in the world now as they were 60 years ago like Britain, France and Russia are keen to cling onto their exclusive UNSC seat.

China can’t really lose here.

No wonder Japan are talking about cutting their UN contribution. After all, you think China would happily pay almost a fifth of the entire regualar contribution to an international organisation and receive next to nothing in return?

China expects something in return for every copper coin it spends and it tries and expects to dominate bodies like ASEAN even though it isn’t even a full member.

That’s the long and short of it.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:11 am | Comment

bingfeng writes:
“hehe, unfortunately i didn’t have a lot of chances to receive “patriotic education ” in china”

Then I apologise for that remark.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:13 am | Comment

Do you guys really hate Japanese people that much? It’s really scary.

Posted by Laowai 19790204 at July 31, 2005 07:59 AM

————————

laowai,

it’s called PRUDENCE

if you read japanese history and observe their tracks from 1950s till now, you will have the same prudence as i do

i have been to japan and my family has many japanese friends and had a lot of experiences with japanese like exchanging foods with our japanese neighbors in festivals and drinking tea with japanese friends in laoshe teahouse in beijing, there is no reason for me to hate japanese people

July 31, 2005 @ 8:14 am | Comment

track record should not be the sole indicator of future performance, but it is one of the indicators, and in japan’s case, it’s an important one because japan as a nation performs very consistently

July 31, 2005 @ 8:18 am | Comment

bingfeng writes:
“hehe, unfortunately i didn’t have a lot of chances to receive “patriotic education ” in china”

Then I apologise for that remark.

Posted by Martyn at July 31, 2005 08:13 AM

————–

no need to apologize, it’s one of the cliches that any chinese who has a negative opinion on japan must have received many “patriotic education” in china.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:20 am | Comment

Bingfeng … “prudence” is it? OK then, I’d say that prudence dictates that Korea, Vietnam, India, Burma, the central Asian republics, and probably a few more states besides ought to expect Chinese attacks, and do their damnest to join any alliance that’ll have them in opposing China. Prudence says Japan is dangerous? Ask the Vietnamese if they think the Chinese or the Japanese are more dangerous …

July 31, 2005 @ 8:31 am | Comment

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[Bomb explodes.]

July 31, 2005 @ 8:33 am | Comment

i have been to japan and my family has many japanese friends and had a lot of experiences with japanese like exchanging foods with our japanese neighbors in festivals and drinking tea with japanese friends in laoshe teahouse in beijing, there is no reason for me to hate japanese people

Do your Japanese friends read your blog?

July 31, 2005 @ 8:39 am | Comment

Ask the Vietnamese if they think the Chinese or the Japanese are more dangerous …

Posted by Filthy Stinking No.9 at July 31, 2005 08:31 AM

———————-

as a “history expert”, you should know who is the most dangerous threat to china

certainly you have your logic – to vietnamese, japan is less dangerous than chian, so chinese preduence for japan is unnecessary. congratulations to your “theory”

July 31, 2005 @ 8:40 am | Comment

Do your Japanese friends read your blog?

Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 08:39 AM

————

no real communication about these topics at all, whenever i start to ask questions of this kind, they become silent, or just nod nod nod nod, “hayi, hayi, hayi, hayi ” or more vaguely “sodesne”

so i didn’t tell them i keep a blog like this, but i am very sure that they know i hold a very strong sentment against right-wing japanese

July 31, 2005 @ 8:46 am | Comment

and here is a very interesting story i experienced with a japanese girl

i kept up a correspondence with a japanese girl who once studied in china for almost one year, and when she went back japan for vacation, i sent mails to her home, then guess what, she suddently disappeared.

very probably her family is not happy with her socializing with chinese asked her not writing to me anymore.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:54 am | Comment

Do your Japanese friends read your blog?

Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 08:39 AM

——————————-

a sincere question – how your chinese wife looks at you after she reads your blog?

July 31, 2005 @ 8:57 am | Comment

BF, I don’t really have any response to your remarks except to say that you sound like the Hawks in my country, talking about China/Russia/Communists/Cuba/Democrats. Time to whip out the Nazis – the Nazis brought up Jewish “history” as proof of their predation upon the noble Aryan race… and that incident sure as hell wasn’t worth it, and didn’t bring any good to the world. I guess my point is that there’s a difference between reasonable caution – i.e. making damn sure that a country’s rhetoric doesn’t pierce through to unmitigated violence – and unreasonable hate – i.e. adopting a “China Containment Policy” that many senators would have us do, or try by any means necessary to oppress and demolish the Japanese economy and their flourishing and happiness.

I guess my other point, BF, is that you don’t come off as being anti-right wing Japanese. You come off as being anti-japanese, and virulently, hatefully so.

I feel like this is all going to lead to a big violent disaster, but when it does, will China admit its future wrongdoing like Germany? Or be like what they say the Japanese are?

July 31, 2005 @ 9:21 am | Comment

Of course, looking at the link in the post below reminds me that there as much seething hate on the other side of the Japanese/Chinese sea. Someone better put a fricking cap on it and figure out how to work it out diplomatically otherwise it’s going to be WWIII, and I, for one, don’t want that to happen to China or Japan, having quite a bit of admiration and love for both countries.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:39 am | Comment

Hey, how’s everybody doing? Richard, you’re going back to Asia! Fabulous! I’m lost in the Balkans! Internet not cheap, missing China already. Can only comment in telegraph form. stop.

Hope to be back to blogging in a couple of weeks. And a quick question… any of you guys know anybody over at CCTV9? I’d like to interview somebody who currently (not Joan Maltese, I’ve read her article) works for China’s international foreign language TV operations.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:39 am | Comment

Dave, check your email. Good to see you.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:51 am | Comment

Back to the top part of this thread of comments about penis envy and all. Just back from a weekend in Xichang, Sichuan, home of the launch pad for China’s space rockets.

Yesterday I saw the damnedest thing ever in my life. I am not drawing any conclusions just yet and seek other opinions, especial from the Chinese friends here. Anyway, I was shopping at a supermarket in Xichang and saw this guy walk up to the back of a Chinese woman and rub or appear to rub his crotch against her. No reaction from the actually young woman. Then the guy again walks up to the back of a woman (could be the same one) and definitely rub his crotch on her buttocks. No reaction for the girl. While was was scratching my head, figuratively, the girl looks at me looking at her. I could not see any embarrassment or anger. The guy has meanwhile wandered off. The the hell?

The weekend was the celebration of the Torch Festival for a national minority (which includes the opportunity for mating by the minority’s young people.) Could this be some weird or psycho part of their mating rituals?

Any thoughts, and I expect the usual joke around, but I am curious if it is one man’s bang or some thing related to the mating game.

July 31, 2005 @ 11:21 am | Comment

Money, Power, Greedy leaders, what else left in the expansion of UNSC?

If there is nothing else, then this game will be naturally played according to the rules based upon the power, money and strategies of leaders from various nations. Nobody should be blamed as long as the rules obeyed.

If you blame China, then why don’t you think a little more about the motives of “G4″? What are they seeking?

as if expansion of UNSC would do any good to UN…..sorry I don’t think so.

July 31, 2005 @ 1:25 pm | Comment

I think it would do a tremendous amount of good to add the four. But I would also take away the veto too.

July 31, 2005 @ 1:39 pm | Comment

if it aint broke…

July 31, 2005 @ 2:21 pm | Comment

Bingfeng said:

how your chinese wife looks at you after she reads your blog?

My wife doesn’t like some of the things I say sometimes, but unlike you, she also admits that I wouldn’t be able to say such things if they weren’t true.

I see you didn’t answer my question, do your Japanese friends read your blog?

Your comments kind of remind me of the racist redneck bastards in the US. They would always say something like..Oh I’m not racist, I know one or two black people. argghh..

July 31, 2005 @ 7:29 pm | Comment

Bingfeng said:

i have only one word for the japanese foreign minister’s comment – *shameless* (anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)

And you say you’re not racist and don’t hate the Japanese…heh!

July 31, 2005 @ 7:40 pm | Comment

I see you didn’t answer my question, do your Japanese friends read your blog?

—————————-

“so i didn’t tell them i keep a blog like this, ………………

Posted by bingfeng at July 31, 2005 08:46 AM ”

S*i*t*h, not sure what’s wrong with your reading ability :)

July 31, 2005 @ 7:44 pm | Comment

must have been the cluttered way you make your posts that caused me to miss that comment.

July 31, 2005 @ 7:47 pm | Comment

Bingfeng said:

i have only one word for the japanese foreign minister’s comment – *shameless* (anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)
And you say you’re not racist and don’t hate the Japanese…heh!

Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 07:40 PM

——————

Gordon answers the question for Bingfeng:

“I wouldn’t be able to say such things if they weren’t true”

July 31, 2005 @ 7:49 pm | Comment

thank you Gordon-S/i/t/h for answering the question for me.

damn the duck censorship :)

July 31, 2005 @ 7:52 pm | Comment

My wife doesn’t like some of the things I say sometimes, but unlike you, she also admits that I wouldn’t be able to say such things if they weren’t true.

—————–

honest answer, but if one loves another enough, he will avoid saying such things that make her unhappy

July 31, 2005 @ 7:55 pm | Comment

honest answer, but if one loves another enough, he will avoid saying such things that make her unhappy

I disagree. One of the things that my wife admires most about me is that I’m always honest.

I have more respect for someone that paints a picture in truth rather than painting it to show only what someone wants to see.

In other words, I don’t believe in protecting someone from the truth.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:00 pm | Comment

In response to his racist comment, Bingfeng says:

“I wouldn’t be able to say such things if they weren’t true”

uh huh.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:01 pm | Comment

No censorship! I had to ban the word “s*th” because some asshole spammer using the name s*th has been bombarding me with bea$tiality spam.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:15 pm | Comment

In response to his racist comment

———-

what racist comment are you talking about?

“anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect”

- he is a japanese and will do anything defend his country even lies in front of the whole world

is this what you call a racist comment, S/i/t/h?

July 31, 2005 @ 8:17 pm | Comment

I borrowed this little
comment
 from Jodi, over at The Asia Pages

First, my impressions of Japan based on Kyoto and Hiroshima.

For one thing, the country is immaculately clean. No spitting, no cigarette butts littering the ground, no trash lying about and no overwhelming stenches of vomit, urine/sewage or rotting garbage. The country of Japan seems to have a very pleasant environment and atmosphere compared to other countries I have visited.

Also, it was quite quiet. Even on the trains, customers were told to put their cells on vibrate and if they received a call or had to make one, they went into the space between cars to have their conversations. So in a way, it was a very peaceful ride for everyone. Both my friend and I found such courtesy refreshing and relaxing.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:19 pm | Comment

Bingfeng says:

- he is a japanese and will do anything defend his country even lies in front of the whole world

is this what you call a racist comment, S/i/t/h?

No BF, this is:

(anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)

July 31, 2005 @ 8:22 pm | Comment

I personally think the PRC shouldn’t even be on the Security Council. It isn’t even this (so-called) government’s seat.
Japan contributes a lot to the UN. It is also a government that is representative of the people rather than a brutal ruling clique doing all it can to hold on to its corrupt power.
So I would recommend that Japan takes China’s seat.
I assume some peole are going to be opposed to that idea. But really, what does China bring to the UN?

July 31, 2005 @ 8:26 pm | Comment

porn magazines are available everywhere, and they are not wrapped and put into a cornor like what i see in the US or HK

high middle school girls put mini ads in phone booth to sell their used pants or “assist socializing”

salary men in nice suits pissed in streets after drinking a few glasses of beer or sakai

japan is clean outside, dirty inside

July 31, 2005 @ 8:27 pm | Comment

Bingfeng says:

- he is a japanese and will do anything defend his country even lies in front of the whole world
is this what you call a racist comment, S/i/t/h?

No BF, this is:

(anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)
Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 08:22 PM

——————————

perhaps you should learn one english word – CONTEXT

but anyway, this trick is widely used by ccp in brainwashing people back in 1960s and 1970s

July 31, 2005 @ 8:31 pm | Comment

Gordon,

i have another clean and quite place to recommend to you – Nazi Germany

July 31, 2005 @ 8:32 pm | Comment

I personally think the PRC shouldn’t even be on the Security Council. It isn’t even this (so-called) government’s seat.
Japan contributes a lot to the UN. It is also a government that is representative of the people rather than a brutal ruling clique doing all it can to hold on to its corrupt power.
So I would recommend that Japan takes China’s seat.
I assume some peole are going to be opposed to that idea. But really, what does China bring to the UN?

Posted by kevin at July 31, 2005 08:26 PM

————

a nice dream, for one day :)

July 31, 2005 @ 8:37 pm | Comment

I have a better idea for reforming the UN Security Council. How about if NO Asian nation has a permanent seat? Then China and Japan will be equal.
I think China’s seat should be taken by Canada. All of the best Chinese people are in Canada anyway. :-)

July 31, 2005 @ 8:40 pm | Comment

Bingfeng,

1. Nazi Germany doesn’t exist anymore.

i have only one word for the japanese foreign minister’s comment – *shameless* (anyway he is a japanese, what else you can expect)

2. I don’t see that I’ve taken anything out of *context*. Those are your words as you typed them.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:41 pm | Comment

Well, not to hijack this thread away from the priority issue of Japanese perfidy, but I need some practical help. Can anyone tell me where to get a GOOD haircut ANYwhere in China?
I keep procrastinating, because I’ve never gotten a decent haircut in China. Haven’t had a haircut for over a year. Yesterday I tried, in the center of a major city here – where all the posh shops are – and a hairstylist showed me the rates written in Chinglish:
“1. Hair for Foreigner Group 288 Yuan,
2. Hair for Foreign Teacher Group 188 Yuan.”
What the hell is “Hair for Foreigner Group?”
I walked out of the place, didn’t want to risk getting a “Foreigner Group” treatment. It sounded like some kind of group sex.
Help me out. How can I find a REAL hairstylist in China?

July 31, 2005 @ 8:48 pm | Comment

I think China’s seat should be taken by Canada. All of the best Chinese people are in Canada anyway. :-)

Posted by Ivan at July 31, 2005 08:40 PM

————

are you so sure? seems most of them are back at home now

anyway, i am looking forward to more day-dreaming UN reform proposals, yours is not bad

July 31, 2005 @ 8:49 pm | Comment

high middle school girls put mini ads in phone booth to sell their used pants or “assist socializing”

hmm…as opposed to Chinese girls that are willing to sleep their teachers for better grades?

salary men in nice suits pissed in streets after drinking a few glasses of beer or sakai

That happens in the alley ways of just about every country. However, unlike China, the streets don’t smell like amonia laced cesspools and you don’t find public toilets by sniffing them out.

I see Chinese men piss outside on the walls all the time. Sometimes it’s because the toilets are just too filthy and other times because it’s part of a cultural habit which is fine, I mean, it’s your country..not mine.

The one that got me though, is awhile back some Chinese photographer took a picture of a foreigner pissing in a river and he published it in a Chengdu newspaper to paint a picture that foreigners do not respect China. Yet, I see Chinese people pissing all over the place in public. Don’t even get me started on the little children that walk down the sidewalk and shit and piss in the middle of it whenever the feel the need to go.

China is a dirty third-world country. I hate to say it, but that’s the truth.

I mean for god sakes, you have people digging up dead, disease infested pigs and selling them to markets.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:51 pm | Comment

Help me out. How can I find a REAL hairstylist in China?

Posted by Ivan at July 31, 2005 08:48 PM

———–

ask Gordon, he has a cool hair style

July 31, 2005 @ 8:53 pm | Comment

Well, not to hijack this thread away from the priority issue of Japanese perfidy, but I need some practical help. Can anyone tell me where to get a GOOD haircut ANYwhere in China?

Ivan, I gave up on that a long time ago. Instead, I bought myself some clippers and a pair of good scissors.

Problem solved.

July 31, 2005 @ 8:55 pm | Comment

i didn’t see any chinese kids shit in public but i did see shits, a lot of shits, appear in a “bar street” in the USA

and public toilets get locked to keep them clean and people have to piss in public in beautiful american streets

July 31, 2005 @ 8:59 pm | Comment

Well, about pissing in public, to be balanced about this, I must say it happens a lot in major American cities – largely because of a lack of public toilets.
The Philadelphia subway smells like a sewer, because homeless people often piss there, because they’re thrown out of restaurants etc etc.
Some years ago the Philadelphia City Council considered a bill to create some public toilets, but the bill was killed. Why? Because, the City Council said, “Well if we build public toilets, then the homeless will use them.” Oh and we CAN’T have the HOMELESS using our public toilets, right?
So, the homeless just keep pissing in the subways and in the alleys.
As far as the filth factor goes, I’ve found most American cities to be about equal to China’s. And the street crime is worse in American cities.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:01 pm | Comment

Wow, bingfeng and I actually agree on something!

July 31, 2005 @ 9:03 pm | Comment

Guys, please don’t do this to my comments. Gordon, go a little easier on China, and Bingfeng, stop being so vindictive. Parts of China are 3rd World, but a lot of it is quite wonderful and they are making an effort to improve things.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:03 pm | Comment

what a joke

can you believe that in china people can not get a good haircutting?

i must admit you guys did a great job in brainwashing those who never come to china, one of my friends who come to china for the first time brings a lot of toilet paper with her

July 31, 2005 @ 9:04 pm | Comment

Gordon,
Well, maybe it’s OK for a Republican Roundhead like you to cut your own hair. But I’m a Liberal Cavalier, so, your Puritan solution won’t do for me. :-)
And like all true Liberal Americans, I expect the servants to do such work for me. :-) (Self mockery here, about champagne liberals and their hypocricies….)

July 31, 2005 @ 9:06 pm | Comment

Japan is the cleanest place i have ever been to, no matter what bingfeng wants to say about it.
every time i travel to japan, i just wonder “goddamn, what the hell happened to china?”
anyway, i can’t see how someone could seriously argue that china should have a security council seat, while japan shouldn’t. japan is a representative government that has contributed a lot to the UN, the region, and the world.
the problem is that the only thing that china has over japan is that it is in a UN security council member and japan is not. that’s why it’s acting, basically, like a little baby who is about to get its lollipop taken away. when japan joins the security council, it will be a major blow to chinese confidence.
china views itself as a “great nation” and hopes to be treated as such. but 3300 years of history does not make a great nation. i’m sorry, but there’s nothing great about the current state of affairs here. japan’s development and contribution to the world, especially in the past 60 years, make it a great nation.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:09 pm | Comment

Hey bingfeng,
Come on, lighten up when it comes to such petty things like haircuts. Mostly I think it’s just funny – and also, I’m just vain, and that’s part of the joke.
If you want to take it seriously, then my more serious deduction is that (I think) maybe most Chinese are not accustomed to cutting the softer kinds of Northern European hair, such as I have. So, more seriously, I really do want to find a place which knows how to cut Northern European hair in a careful way.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:11 pm | Comment

A blog I never heard of before has just fisked Madge’s idiotic CD “article.” Quite perceptive.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:14 pm | Comment

Problem solved: A few minutes ago I shaved my head.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:15 pm | Comment

There is no denying Japan is one of the cleanest, most developed places on earth. Just because there’s a thriving sex industry there doesn’t make it less clean. Hell, there’s a thriving sex industry in every country. Even China. Just go to a Chinese “hair salon” if you doubt it.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:19 pm | Comment

Ivan,

It’s like Chinese people say in America..American hair stylists don’t know how to cut Asian people’s hair.

Same goes in China – they don’t know how to cut foreigners hair.

Of course, I don’t go to the barber shops here anymore since I cut my own hair, but when I did they never wanted to cut it the way I told them. I like a tight clean cut, military style. But noooooo, they always want to cut it like they do for Chinese men – with a beveled out square look.

I’d end up having to take the clippers and do it myself.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:22 pm | Comment

gordon can cut his own hair, and always eat chickens, very impressive

what a S*i*t*h we have!

July 31, 2005 @ 9:27 pm | Comment

Let’s compare China with Egypt and its historical significance. Both with great histories and mummies. That doesn’t make either one a great country now a days.

SURPRISING ME NO ENDING IS THE LACK OF ANY RESPONSES TO MY COMMENT ABOVE ABOUT THE PERVERT OR HORNY “DOG” I OBSERVED ON SATURDAY.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:27 pm | Comment

Gordon, Never eat the chickens.You might catch a nasty infection.No Kissing either!

July 31, 2005 @ 9:28 pm | Comment

Pete, I read that comment and it amazed me. What do you make of it? It was just so strange…

July 31, 2005 @ 9:30 pm | Comment

i didn’t see any chinese kids shit in public but i did see shits, a lot of shits, appear in a “bar street” in the USA

Bingfeng, I was talking about the children who shit and piss on the sidewalks in China…that dosen’t happen in America.

I can’t count the number of times that I’ve seen a kid relieve himself right in the middle of the sidewalk here in China. It’s one thing when they pee, but it’s quite another when they take a dump.

It’s all so easy..thats why they have that little slit in the back of their pants.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:33 pm | Comment

Yeah, I eat chicken. Only chicken.
Can’t eat the fish because it comes out of China’s beautifully clean rivers.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:37 pm | Comment

I won’t fault the Chinese for split pants, which have been part of their culture for a long time. I will point out, howeever, that I have seen teenage guys piss on the busy sidewalks in Fudan and elsewhere as though no one else was there, people having to sidestep them to escape the spray. Once I saw a guy actually taking a crap on the side of the road in plain sight. They are a developiong country and it will take time for them to step into the modern world. In the meantime, such scenes, sadly, do little for their image.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:38 pm | Comment

Ivan, Are those homeless in Philly Chinese?

July 31, 2005 @ 9:40 pm | Comment

AM, you promised to tone down the one-liners. I’m counting on you, help stay on topic. Be funny, but stay on topic.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:43 pm | Comment

What is the topic? Weekend Thread?It’s Monday here.

July 31, 2005 @ 9:54 pm | Comment

Well, we’ve been discussing some pretty heavy topics here, AM — like Chinese haircuts. Such topics require a degree of seriousness and maturity.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:00 pm | Comment

The new American craze — learning Putonghua!!

July 31, 2005 @ 10:01 pm | Comment

Thanks for pointing to that article Richard. I sent a copy of it to my Chinese professor in the States.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:15 pm | Comment

Kevin,

“Japan is the cleanest place i have ever been to, no matter what bingfeng wants to say about it. every time i travel to japan, i just wonder “goddamn, what the hell happened to china?” anyway, i can’t see how someone could seriously argue that china should have a security council seat, while japan shouldn’t.”

Should security council be another G8 club? Considering taking a poll in some mideastern countries, between US and China, which country people there will believe to vote for the best of their interests? Well, according to you, why should the interests of those people count? They are not managing their city as clean as Japanese are.

BTW, I am not against Japan having a seat in security council. For me, China deserve security council seat just because there are people like you in this world.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:15 pm | Comment

Are you one of those ugly Chinese
tourists
 when you travel or do you behave
yourself?

July 31, 2005 @ 10:16 pm | Comment

Oops, sorry, that last comment was directed at Bing Fengus.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:18 pm | Comment

Come on Gordon, don’t make fun of his name. Okay?

Damn, I feel like a hall monitor today.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:19 pm | Comment

Why not?..He calls me S/i/t/h.

BingFengus is just my affectionate pet name for him.

July 31, 2005 @ 10:28 pm | Comment

Richard:
Because in both incidents the women did not turn around or look around at the guy, I am thinking it might be some extraordinary, ordinary mating practice. In the second incident the guy did actually, how shallI say this with both meaning and sensitivity, well he was dicking them on the outside.

It was so strange. This was in the afternoon with plenty of people in the supermarket. The guy appeared to be in his 30s, was neat and clean in appearance and did not appear to be from the hills. The most striking thing, excluding the actions themselves, was the second girl’s look of no concern.

July 31, 2005 @ 11:02 pm | Comment

Hey Richard,
What, you feel like a “Hall Monitor?” :-) Oh, that brings back such funny memories. Back to my Middle School in (xxx) somewhere in an old East Coast province of America:
…oh, I remember, around 13 years old, the other boys and I did the “patented xxxx-flip-kick” and we would flip each other’s knees, all over the hall, and then the “hall monitor” would take bribes from us to refrain from reporting it to the authorities. Like around ten cents.
(Well this was in the 1970′s, the bribe might be around a dollar now.)
And our “hall monitors” would turn a blind eye to fistfights in the hall, if he bribed them with a dime OR with some really cool pens, OR with something sexual, ie “I’ll tell so and so that you want to walk home from school with her….” :-)
Oh, HALL MONITORS! Ah, reminds me of a more innocent time and place, where a dime or a word to a pretty girl would excuse a multitude of sins…. :-)
…(seriously, getting very sentimental here, about my memories of an older and more innocent time and place in America….)

July 31, 2005 @ 11:04 pm | Comment

Pete, it is strange….
I can’t even imagine that gals are still to timid to fight against these kind of dirty behaviors nowadays in China. Your story made me really sick.

July 31, 2005 @ 11:10 pm | Comment

In response to your link above about Americans learning Chinese, here’s one about A Chinese language competition  in Shanghai’s Fudan University on June 26, the team of foreign students won over the team of
Chinese students.

July 31, 2005 @ 11:20 pm | Comment

LW, I did not say that Japan should have a security council seat because it is a clean country. I pointed out that it is a clean country, because certain people were making insane arguments that it was a less than clean country.
Then, I went on to my point, which you obviously ignored, that Japan has contributed so much to the UN, the region, and the entire world, that I am suprised that it does not already have a seat.
Frankly, I don’t think that China votes in the interests of the downtrodden people of the world, just as it does not protect the workers within its own borders.
You say, “Considering taking a poll in some mideastern countries, between US and China, which country people there will believe to vote for the best of their interests?” Ummm… I’ve got a better idea, let’s hold the poll in Africa, asking the people of Sudan’s Darfur region and the people of Zimbabwe!
“For me, China deserve security council seat just because there are people like you in this world.” Can’t quite follow the logic on that one. I have no influence at the UN.

July 31, 2005 @ 11:52 pm | Comment

Why not?..He calls me S/i/t/h.

BingFengus is just my affectionate pet name for him.

Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 10:28 PM

————–

every time we are in a competition of sense of humor, it’s always you who loses first :)

August 1, 2005 @ 12:13 am | Comment

Well, we’ve been discussing some pretty heavy topics here, AM — like Chinese haircuts. Such topics require a degree of seriousness and maturity.

Posted by richard at July 31, 2005 10:00 PM

————

seems we are all affected by the mood, even richard start to become humorous

August 1, 2005 @ 12:16 am | Comment

the idea that china will lose its permanent seat is absurd. think about a concept called the status quo.
if china lost its seat the UN would be like an aircraft tailspinning — all the relationships and alliances would massively shift and spin and there’d be chaos.
what’s more, giving Japan a seat would disappoint many Asian countries not least because it would give a great boost to Japan’s diplomatic clout.
if you want to shake up the UN, well, maybe there are some reasons for doing that.
but to take away china’s seat and give it to Japan! because you like Japan more than China!

I mean, would the world have been a better place without the USSR on the UNSC during the cold war? of course not.

the UNSC is not some club for best friends or countries with the best-kept streets.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:19 am | Comment

AM, you promised to tone down the one-liners. I’m counting on you, help stay on topic. Be funny, but stay on topic.

Posted by richard at July 31, 2005 09:43 PM

————-

ha, amerika mann is coming back

“give your blog a little class” LOL

August 1, 2005 @ 12:19 am | Comment

Yeah, I eat chicken. Only chicken.
Can’t eat the fish because it comes out of China’s beautifully clean rivers.

Posted by Gordon at July 31, 2005 09:37 PM

——————

Gordon the chicken-lover,

i have a great and easy chicken recipe for you:

http://tinyurl.com/blt23

August 1, 2005 @ 12:26 am | Comment

well thanks to that link from bingfeng I now know what my favourite food in china is called in english.
“make sure you use lots of that bunge prickly ash please, chef”!

August 1, 2005 @ 12:31 am | Comment

I’m not saying that there is any possibility of China losing its seat. I just think that Japan really deserves a seat, and tend to feel that China doesn’t.
It’s not because I like Japan more than China, it is because Japan has contributed to the UN and to the entire world much more than China ever has. So, why should Japan not have a seat? Mainly because it will make China jealous. That’s the root of it all.
My ramblings about the PRC not having a UN seat were clearly something that would never happen. I have a better chance of winning the lottery.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:37 am | Comment

Yes, this is Richard’s best comment in ages:

“Well, we’ve been discussing some pretty heavy topics here, AM — like Chinese haircuts. Such topics require a degree of seriousness and maturity.”

August 1, 2005 @ 12:41 am | Comment

pete:

I read your comment about the wierd supermarket incident last night and I didn’t comment on it because it was just too wierd I thought. I’ve never seen or heard of anything like that before I must say.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:43 am | Comment

i agree with kevin, the seats should be reserved for those who contribute the largest chunk of money

let japan replace chian and germany replace russia

and next time when china pays more than japan, let china replace japan again

if japan pay more than the US, japan should replace the US, and if hongkong pays more than mainland china, hongkong replace mainland china, so we have japan and hongkong

if taiwan can pay more than germany, why can’t we replace germany with taiwan, maybe france should be replaced by saudi and britain replaced by singapore

if japan can’t pay more money than china, it should borrow the money from china and share the seat with china, and US share the seat with taiwan, so taiwan pay less than the US still get a half-seat, if japan pays less money than saudi, bin laden should send japan some money to pay the UN bill …….

August 1, 2005 @ 12:49 am | Comment

Sorry bingfeng, people can contribute other things besides money.
I know you may not grasp this, but “contribute” does not necessarily indicate money.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:53 am | Comment

Japan’s contribution to the world is a compensation for its sins.

When that is enough is not solely decided by itself but also the victims.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:53 am | Comment

Sorry bingfeng, people can contribute other things besides money.
I know you may not grasp this, but “contribute” does not necessarily indicate money.

Posted by kevin at August 1, 2005 12:53 AM

————

in order to win the game, kevin changes the game rules.

do you know why UN was established. hint : it’s related with japan

August 1, 2005 @ 12:58 am | Comment

i did not change the rules of the game.
you simply did not understand my post.
in fact, the tone of your rhetoric on japan makes me feel that there is a lot you don’t understand.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:01 am | Comment

but Bing, there are thousands upon thousands of historical “sins” carried out by each and every nation at various times. You can’t just keep poking at Japan and ignoring everything else.

You know and I know, for example, that at the beginning of each Chinese dynasty, the new rulers would gather, in most cases, the largest standing army in the world and march to China’s borders to attack those countries on the periphery. The Tang for example, assembled 500,000 men and marched them down into Vietnam for a mass slaughter. Go to Vietnam and you’ll see statue after statue, like those of the Trong sisters, who rose up against Chinese invaders.

History is full of these atrocities and THIS is what most people think of when they hear Chinese people bleating on about Japan’s war crimes. This highly selective view of history is very, er, highly selective!

August 1, 2005 @ 1:01 am | Comment

the current govt has slaughtered more than the amount that died in WWII.
yet some people here are blind enough to go on and on about japan?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:08 am | Comment

It’s not because I like Japan more than China, it is because Japan has contributed to the UN and to the entire world much more than China ever has. So, why should Japan not have a seat? ………..

Posted by kevin at August 1, 2005 12:37 AM

————

kevin, i didn’t understand your post?

your underlying logic that those who contribute more money to UN deserve a seat is so ridiculous that even yourself cannot defend it

August 1, 2005 @ 1:09 am | Comment

bingfeng, you are so ridiculous that you can’t even understand that i was not referring only to money, as i said above.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:11 am | Comment

The simple fact of the matter is that you didn’t understand my English, bingfeng.
¡°¹±Ïס±²»Ò»¶¨Ö¸½ðÇ®°É£¡

August 1, 2005 @ 1:19 am | Comment

bingfeng, you are so ridiculous that you can’t even understand that i was not referring only to money, as i said above.

Posted by kevin at August 1, 2005 01:11 AM

————

so what are you referring to?

it’s very clear that the “contribution” here mainly refers to money

you are very funny to defend your point in such a childish way

August 1, 2005 @ 1:20 am | Comment

Kevin, absolutely true, more people were killed by the insane economic policies of the post-”liberation” CCP than by the Imperial Japanese Army. Another difference–the Japanese Army were fighting a declared war wearing uniforms. Again, selective history.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:21 am | Comment

Maryn

Sure China had a lot of sins in history. But it’s now 21 century.

Countries like China can no longer advance its society in a similar way as British or Japan which kept launching wars to enrich its own country by brutally exploiting others.

We can’t copy that way. Why? This is a different world.

The same applies for Japan. The sins it committed did not happen 100 years ago.

What’s more, for the second biggest economy and such a highly developed country, Japan’s attitude towards his history is by any means amazing.

See what Germans have done to repent, or what British and other developed countries have done for Africa.

And it’s not just abuot the money you paid to the victims, but the attitude.

Most Germans and westerners not only take responsibility for but recognise their sins in the past.

That’s a stark contrast to the Japanese.

To some extent, they haven’t really changed that much in the last century.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:23 am | Comment

Hmmm, I wonder why sometimes TPD accpets Chinese characters and sometimes it doesn’t. I’ve never had the same problem as Kevin above but I use a Chinese-language only computer–does that make a difference?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:23 am | Comment

It’s a difference between UNICODE and GB2312

August 1, 2005 @ 1:24 am | Comment

sorry, bingfeng, i don’t think i am being childish by saying that you were unable to understand my post.
in fact, there are quite a number of your posts that i don’t understand either!
when i said “contribution,” i did not only mean financially, but also diplomatically, leadership-wise.
come on, ¹±Ïס£ gongxian! you understand that. that means contribute. does that refer only to money? give me a break!
although i know that with the current corrupt and materialistic state of chinese society, you may assume that “contribute” means money, but i must inform you that there is more to the world than money.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:27 am | Comment

today is PLA day in china

long live the PLA

August 1, 2005 @ 1:30 am | Comment

Most kinds of contribution are viable only on the condition that somebody provides the money.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:31 am | Comment

tell me what other great “contributions” did japan made to the UN that china didn’t make?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:32 am | Comment

Money

August 1, 2005 @ 1:33 am | Comment

A lot more money. That’s it.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:34 am | Comment

Oh yeah, and peace keeping soldiers who stick to their impregnable fortress playing PS2.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:36 am | Comment

One example: peacekeeping missions, which China never got involved in until Haiti due to its paranoia about “internal affairs.”

August 1, 2005 @ 1:36 am | Comment

Soldiers like I metioned in last post.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:37 am | Comment

yeah, what Bing says makes a lot of sense

how about this Kevin, japan replace china next year, and as soon as china contributes more money than japan, let china replace japan

it’s a fair deal. OK? done. move on.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:40 am | Comment

Martyn, for some reason, I have been able to post Hanzi using Firefox but not using Safari.

Here’s a test: ???????

August 1, 2005 @ 1:41 am | Comment

That is a fair point Bing, yes, the Japanese are not as contrite as the Germans or the Brits. We all remember Willy Brant, Germany’s leader, going to the Warsaw Ghetto Memorial in 1972 and spontaneously falling to his knees and breaking down in tears. It was a moving and heartfelt gesture which finally moved Germany firmly into the post-war world in the eyes of its WWII victims.

However, and in all fairness, a lot of what you say about Japan for its dubious attitude towards its own history can also be squarely levelled against modern China.

One example, as above, Vietnam. The Vietnamese suffered 1,000+ years of Chinese military incursions. 1,000 years of slaughter and attempted cultural domination BUT we don’t hear the Vietnamese demanding an apology from China.

Regarding your point about China’s atrocities happening ‘a very long time ago’. The last time Chinese tanks rolled into Vietnam was 1979. Albeit they faced the veterans of the Vietnam-US war and were slaughtered in their thousands for their troubles—despite Chinese HISTORY books that say that China has not lost a single war since 1949.

Again, go to Vietnam and the people their will tell you (as they told me) that China is the only real enemy of the Vietnamese people and they look at China today and feel that it hasn’t changed at all.

Do you see any similarities here with your China-Japan view?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:43 am | Comment

Okay, here’s another test (using firefox):

我现在用别的 browser -

August 1, 2005 @ 1:43 am | Comment

你们会计不会看我写的汉字?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:45 am | Comment

Japan is one of the largest donors of Humanitarian aid.

Such as:

~Food
~urban development
~medical research/vaccinations

on and on and aon…

Better yet, what has China provided to the world? How has China used its seat on the UN to represent and improve the societies of its Asian neighbors?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:45 am | Comment

bingfeng snorts:
————–
“japan replace china next year, and as soon as china contributes more money than japan, let china replace japan.”
————–
Haha! That is a good one. KLS will enjoy the logic of that one without a doubt.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:46 am | Comment

Yes Lisa, I can read your ºº×Ö¡£

August 1, 2005 @ 1:46 am | Comment

Again, you ignore and twist what I am saying. But I wouldn’t expect anything more. In this thread, you have said that Japan is not a clean country, you have refused to acknowledge that “contributions” does not necessarily refer to money, and you have made blatantly racist remarks against the Japanese.
You then have the nerve to refer to me as childish? I’m sorry Bingfeng, but you seem to miss the point over and over again, and then you toss out rubbish like “it’s PLA day! Long live the PLA!” Give me a break, man.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:47 am | Comment

Oops – assuming you can read those characters, I have no idea why that ji4 is in there…

August 1, 2005 @ 1:47 am | Comment

But weirdly enough, Gordon, I can’t read yours…what browser are you using?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:48 am | Comment

speaking of another chinese military adventure, the people of north korea are thanking the PLA to this day for their role in “liberating” them!

August 1, 2005 @ 1:49 am | Comment

Ahhh, yes. That might explain it as I use Firefox. Gordon sometimes has problems posting Chinese as well and I’m pretty sure that he doesn’t use Firefox.

Compliments on your Chinese Lisa. I actually put that “To Chinese Readers” post I translated, into pinyin with a glossary of all the vocabulary especially for you but didn’t send you it in the end as I thought it was a crap idea in the end.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:50 am | Comment

I tried posting with IE. It always does that when I try to post in Chinese on TPD.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:52 am | Comment

Oh, Martyn, please do send me that! My pinyin is SO much better than my Hanzi! No comparison. I suck at written Chinese. I’m taking a class later this summer that I hope will help me.

I am also wondering if this has to do with browser preferences as opposed to just the browser…

August 1, 2005 @ 1:53 am | Comment

————– Japan

“In order to play a more active role in maintaining international peace by contributing personnel in addition to funds and materials, Japan took a significant step in June 1992 by enacting the Law Concerning Cooperation for United Nations Peacekeeping Operations and Other Operations (the “International Peace Cooperation Law”), thereby instituting a framework for dispatching personnel overseas to participate in international peace and relief efforts.”

————— CHINA

Since the 1990s, China has sent 500 military observers person/time to the relevant UN peace-keeping operations. It sent an engineering team of 800 persons to Cambodia and 55 civilian policemen to the UN administrative authorities in East Timor. On 4 January this year, the Chinese Government again sent 5 civilian peace-keeping policemen to the UN mission in Bosnia-Herzegovina.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:56 am | Comment

Martyn, also, looking at your post, I could see idioms there that I don’t know and I’d like to learn. I’d love that Pinyin/vocab translation, if you still have it.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:57 am | Comment

好吗? 可以看不看?

August 1, 2005 @ 1:58 am | Comment

hmm..the last one was done with Firefox.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:01 am | Comment

Martyn

I was waiting for you to grab the Vietnamese analogue.

“One example, as above, Vietnam. The Vietnamese suffered 1,000+ years of Chinese military incursions. 1,000 years of slaughter and attempted cultural domination BUT we don’t hear the Vietnamese demanding an apology from China.”

For two adjacent countries, the responsibilities for wars between them in history often lie on both sides. In this case, first of all you understand very well there is history revision in China, the same applies in Vietnam.

Many major invasions by China were not the work of Chinese Han courts, but local warlords or ethnic minority ruling class who at the time ruled China.

In terms of 1,000 years of slaughter, the last 3,000 years China were under constant attacks, looting and invasions throughout our borders. I’m sure Vietnamese were not weak or kind enough to only build fortress and have never tried pestering China.

“Regarding your point about China’s atrocities happening ‘a very long time ago’. The last time Chinese tanks rolled into Vietnam was 1979. Albeit they faced the veterans of the Vietnam-US war and were slaughtered in their thousands for their troubles—despite Chinese HISTORY books that say that China has not lost a single war since 1949. ”

That’s a war, OK? You never know what the red Vietnam with Soviet support would do after occupying Cambodia. Notice here, they invaded Cambodia first.

As to who lost, I can’t understand why you think China lost. Is that because China had more fatalities than Vietnam? I don’t think so. Besides, the war was fought on their lands and as I know, most of its heavy factories were totally destroyed.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:01 am | Comment

·Ç³£Âß¼­

August 1, 2005 @ 2:03 am | Comment

我看了!

我现在睡觉-明天见!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:03 am | Comment

And in terms of similarities, China has never landed a single soldier on Japan.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:03 am | Comment

Martyn – 我真喜欢看你翻译的文章!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:04 am | Comment

·Ç³£Âß¼­

August 1, 2005 @ 2:05 am | Comment

Bingfeng – 我不会看你写的汉字。我不知道为什么!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:06 am | Comment

And now those of us in the Pacific Time zone really do need to get some sleep. Night all!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:07 am | Comment

The “会看了” was for Gordon. I can’t read yours, Bingfeng. No idea why!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:09 am | Comment

ºÃÂ𣿠¿ÉÒÔ¿´²»¿´£¿

Posted by Gordon at August 1, 2005 01:58 AM

———–

hao ma? keyi kan bu kan?

englinese?

keyi kan ma? kan bu kan de dao? keyi kan dao ma? kan hai shi kan bu dao? kan dao mei? kan de dao ma?

August 1, 2005 @ 2:11 am | Comment

martyn’s chinese is perfect

August 1, 2005 @ 2:13 am | Comment

I don’t think it’s very nice to make jokes about others’ Chinese, especially when you own English is so unintelligible, Bing feng.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:17 am | Comment

also, bingfeng, you never responded about the word “gongxian.”

August 1, 2005 @ 2:21 am | Comment

I don’t think it’s very nice to make jokes about others’ Chinese, especially when you own English is so unintelligible, Bing feng.

Posted by kevin at August 1, 2005 02:17 AM

————

apologies!

my english is broken, indeed!

August 1, 2005 @ 2:25 am | Comment

Bing

Haha, yes, sorry about dusting off the old “Vietnam 1,000 years of Chinese incursions” example again. It’s served me well on TPD. I must read up on further of historical examples of Chinese slaughter!

God, if someone Googles “Vietnam China 1,000 years” the poor saps will likely end up reading one of my many TPD comments!

Anyway, I don’t want to get into who won the 1979 war as it’s subjective. Yes, the chinese gave Vietnam a bloody nose but at a terrible cost, much like Korea. Even Mao’s son died there.

Re your point about the responsibilities for wars often lie on both sides. I’d argue that this doesn’t really apply to China-Vietnam as the relationship between the culturally/military advanced Middle Kingdom and the lands of the Viets and Khmers (once The Kindom of Yue along with modern day Yunan, Guangxi and Guangdong) is very dissimilar to the historical fighting between say the French and the Germans, the English and the French and the Burmese and the Thais.

Your point about local warlords fighting the Viets is partially right as one cannot generalise over 1,000 years BUT most of the attacks on the Viets were made by the Imperial Court of the Middle Kingdom and/or those tributary states/warlords serving the MK. It’s impossible to be between China and VIetnam and not serve the MK.

I hope you’re slightly regretting your “That’s a war, OK?” comment. As I mentioned above, the Japanese fought in uniform and declared war on China. True, the atrocities it commited were grave but atrocities happen during war. Anyway, let’s not get into a tit-for-tat atrocities conversation.

Re attitudes towards atrocities. When I’ve worked in Vietnam, I’m always amazed at the attitudes of Vietnamese towrds America. Despite the carnage and the thousands of tonnes of bombs that rained down on the country, they appear to feel not a jot of ill-will towards America.

“That was then, now you are a guest. If you come again to my country to fight then I’ll take my old weapon and head for the hills again but come as a guest and I’ll welcome you as I welcome a member of my family” was what one US vet told me a old NVA vet had told him in Vietnam a couple of years ago. The American vet’s eyes filled as he told me in a bar.

The US-Vietnam War didn’t happen 60 years ago it happened 30 years ago.

Are you still not seeing any dissimilarities between this and your China-Japan view?

August 1, 2005 @ 2:31 am | Comment

Look at any Chinese-English dictionary, check out the English for the word “gongxian,” and then come back and talk to me about what I mean by “contributions.” thanks.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:39 am | Comment

Please note that the 55 policemen sent to East Timor were the second group sent to East Timor. The first group was sent back to PRC becasue they were poorly trained, had little or no language skills, and (my favourite) couldn’t drive.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:42 am | Comment

Let’s be honest here: some in China WANT to believe that Japan is full of baby-eating evil, cunning monsters in business suits and kimonos. What Japan did during WWII was truly horrible. But to say that people in other nations are therefore better or more deserving of a bright future is bullshiznit. These people are the same in every country. They are the Rednecks gordon made reference to – Whites over Blacks. They are the Right-wingers in Japan – Japan is Best. They are the ueber-menschen crazies that still march around Germany on occasion – Deutschland ueber alles. They are the Hawks in the pentagon – America must be the Strongest. These people are the same everywhere, and if you notice yourself thinking that one race of people is particuarly bereft of humanity, it’s probably because you’ve been pulled over to that way of thinking. It’s racist, it’s mean-spirited, it’s hateful and it’s not going to solve any problems in the future. The people who can see beyond differences, and see the value in humanity, as flawed as it is, that will build the bridges necessary for peace.

With that, I’m off to work.

August 1, 2005 @ 2:43 am | Comment

Oh hell. What the f—, I may as well go into the Bible now.
This is what my great teacher, Jesus said (well, yes I am a Christian. Actually I’m a Catholic, and I know that Richard – who is a Jew, like my Grandfather was a Jew – accepts and tolerates ALL religions here, as long as we are truthful and loving, like my great teacher Jesus the Jewish Rabbi was:
Jesus said:
“Love one another.”
All Humans are guilty, and all Humans are children of God. Including all Japanese and all Americans and all Chinese.
I will follow the teaching of my great Jewish Rabbi, Jesus, and I will wait in hope for the rest of Humanity to follow what he said.
Meanwhile, why don’t we all just lighten up on each other, and realise that in the eyes of God we are ALL silly assholes? Japanese and Chinese and Americans, we are all EQUALLY FOOLISH in the eyes of God!!! … :-)

August 1, 2005 @ 2:55 am | Comment

I have been rather busy lately and haven’t read nearly as much as what has been written. And since there is so much, I thought Iwould just page down and read a few items at the bottom. and so, my comments:

Concerning who won the Chinese invasion of Vietnam, 1979, I do not think it is as subjective as you guys suggest. The Chinese invaded Vietnam because Vietnam invaded Cambodia. The Vietnamese solution to the Cambodian problem is what essentially evolved (albeit it has morphed in directions that the Vietnamese did not wish). The Chinese solution has been rejected completely. That being the case, then it becomes apparant that the Chinese did not get the results they wanted from invading Vietnam; therefore one can say they “lost the war.”

Likewise, I do not know about Vietnam getting a bloody nose, but the Chinese were completely surprised about the resistance and amazed how ineffective their military was. At the time the United States and China military were covertly working closely with one another (not toward Vietnam, but toward the Soviet Union). The inability of the Chinese to achieve their military objectives was taken to heart and they realized the need to reform their military. Just as the First Gulf war did the same (the first Gulf war also inspired the Soviets, but too late for them). The second Gulf War also is important in that aspect.

Concerning the attitude of the Chinese and the Koreans toward Japan, I have been thinking about this lately. Not that I wish to go into some type of psychological these, but I tend to think that the Vietnamese can feel OK toward Americans because they did beat us (well, kind of). But the Chinese and Koreans did not beat the Japanese, the Americans did. The Japanese haven’t apologized to America and America hasn’t apologized to Vietnam, and who really cares. I tend to think that Japan would never be able to apologized often enough or sincere enough to please China and Korea. I think both of them feel ashamed that they were unable to beat that little bitty country of islands out in the sea. I think they want to rub Japan’s nose in the ground, they want to wage bloody war to fulfill their manhood. At least that is what I think. Of course, this does not mean all Chinese nor all Koreans, but there is a noisy crowd that does. At least that is my thinking.

Martyn, I apologize, you had written before that you wrote an economic peice. I have looked for it, perhaps I have the wrong website but I did not see it.

August 1, 2005 @ 3:53 am | Comment

hao ma? keyi kan bu kan?

englinese?

Yes, sometimes I have a bad habit of translating things directly from English to Chinese…doesn’t work so well sometimes as above.

Hao ma? = Okay?
keyi kan bu kan? = can you read it or not?

I don’t mind if bingfeng laughs at that, it only reminds me to pay more attention. Besides, as Kevin pointed out, his English stinks! Most of the 5th grade Chinese students that I’ve had the pleasure of knowing have better written English than him.

August 1, 2005 @ 4:24 am | Comment

Another post on the CD “article” (I’ll paste it, as it’s in bkogspot):
———————————————

Sunday, July 31, 2005
Loving China, blogging China

Some of you folks might wonder why I have a “China Blogs” section on the left-hand column. It’s partly because of my interest in China that I read those sites, and partly because I spent more than a year actively participating in the online forum for the China Daily, which is the official English newspaper of China. I think these “China blogs” are great for a number of reasons, and I like to read them because I often share the sentiments expressed. Basically, I feel these guys, who either have lived in or are living in China, really give good insights into a place I feel affinity for. (My paternal grandparents emmigrated from China to Thailand, and my wife is a Malaysian of Chinese descent.)

Anyway, some folks are offended by foreigners’ comments on Chinese politics. They play on a feeling of shame and deep resentment many Chinese harbor concerning the way colonial powers preyed upon a weak and fractured China in the late 19th and early 20th century. (Of course, the same people stress the forgiveness and willingness to let go of the past when it comes to things like Mao’s Great Leap Forward or the Cultural Revolution.)

For a view into the debate concerning China blogging, check this opinion out.

posted by ts @ 11:09 PM

August 1, 2005 @ 4:32 am | Comment

Those Brits never apologized for what happened in Wembley in 1966.
It was no goal. nao goal no goal.
Shame on those British revisionists!

August 1, 2005 @ 4:33 am | Comment

French love speedos.
Germans love nudism.

August 1, 2005 @ 5:22 am | Comment

Funny feeling sitting on a Japanese toelet, randomly pressing all those mysterious buttons. You never know what will happen.

August 1, 2005 @ 5:26 am | Comment

I once was in a club in Shanghai, where there were people who opened the doors to the toilet for you, giving you wet towles when you had finished your buisness.
That’s what I call caring for your guests.
Though they exagerated this honorabel attitude a bit, from my point of view, when a guy approached me giving me a neck massage, without even asking, while I was in the middle of some private buisness.

August 1, 2005 @ 5:36 am | Comment

Slagging off peoples language abilities, generally speaking, is very poor form. I certainly don’t have the courage to wander onto Chinese language sites and debate–and I’ve completed two degrees in Chinese, one in the UK and one in Beijing. Therefore, I’ve a great deal of respect for Chinese people who come on here and debate.

JFS: my article is on the Horse’s Mouth. Called ‘Hi China, Bye China’. It’s one of the “featured posts” and there’s a link on the upper left sidebar on the HM. HM is bloggrolled on TPD.

Gordon–someone above was talking about the different ways of saying “can” in Chinese I think.

August 1, 2005 @ 5:43 am | Comment

shulan: 1966? Don’t even go there. That was our year. “They think it’s all over, IT IS NOW!”

I’ve heard about these Japanese toilets but never been to Japan unfortuantely. I’ve also heard that in 7-11′s etc Japanese shop assistants keep talking for about 5 minutes after you’ve given them the money and walked away. What are they sayiing?

August 1, 2005 @ 5:50 am | Comment

Yeah, I got it Martyn.

I don’t really mind being criticized about my mistakes. Hell, I crticize my wife on her putonghua pronunciations all the time :-)

Until a few posts ago, I’ve never poked fun at Bingfeng for his poor English skills, but once he opened the door..it was fair game.

August 1, 2005 @ 5:53 am | Comment

By the way, readers should go and read “The Ugly Chinese Tourist” on The Horse’s Mouth. I left a few of my own personal stories in the comments.

Sorry bingfeng, bing etc but those tour groups from Hunan, Hubei, Henan etc are quickly getting a pretty colourful reputation!

http://thehorsesmouth.blog-city.com/

August 1, 2005 @ 5:55 am | Comment

Speaking of ugly Chinese tourists, I tihnk Macau is the ultimate “hotspot” for this, er, phenomenon.

Good grief, has anyone been to Macau in the last couple of years? If you have then I needn’t say more……

August 1, 2005 @ 6:04 am | Comment

I see Martyn, you’r one of them.
I say NO GOAL!

Chinese tourists love German Autobahn. You can book tours were you are given a Mercedes or BMW and then can experience the famous no-speed limit (if you are lucky enough to bypass another thing Autobahns are famous for: traffic jam).

August 1, 2005 @ 6:17 am | Comment

the first time i got a neck massage, i didn’t realize that was an additional service and you have to tip it. i walked away and the waiter followed me like a serial killer …

August 1, 2005 @ 6:18 am | Comment

Until a few posts ago, I’ve never poked fun at Bingfeng for his poor English skills, but once he opened the door..it was fair game.

Posted by Gordon at August 1, 2005 05:53 AM

————

Gordon, you are too sensitive, if you read my original post carefully, you will understand what i want to do is to help you for better expressions of that sentence

August 1, 2005 @ 6:21 am | Comment

Chinese tourists love German Autobahn. You can book tours were you are given a Mercedes or BMW and then can experience the famous no-speed limit (if you are lucky enough to bypass another thing Autobahns are famous for: traffic jam).

Posted by shulan at August 1, 2005 06:17 AM

————

very dangerous!

also very dangerous for chinese to drive in britain, japan, etc.

August 1, 2005 @ 6:23 am | Comment

Speaking of ugly Chinese tourists, I tihnk Macau is the ultimate “hotspot” for this, er, phenomenon.

Good grief, has anyone been to Macau in the last couple of years? If you have then I needn’t say more……

Posted by Martyn at August 1, 2005 06:04 AM

————

you know what i dislike chinese tourists aboard most?

playing cards in the plane! fortunately they didn’t bring mahjong with them

August 1, 2005 @ 6:26 am | Comment

BingFeng, I’m probably one of the least sensitive people you will ever come across.

However, your tone and the way you present yourself on here gave others the idea that you were making wise cracks about my mistake. I wasn’t the only one that thought so.

If you were sincerely trying to be helpful, thank you. As I said, I don’t mind the criticism.

The only bad thing is that I suck with PinYin. I can currently read around 2,000 characters, so if you can give it to me in Chinese, I can probably understand what you are trying to say if you are trying to correct a mistake of mine.

August 1, 2005 @ 6:27 am | Comment

So sad. Lei Feng spirit is not held up in China today. Only money money money, even though tip is not a town in China. :(

August 1, 2005 @ 6:28 am | Comment

Pursuing wealth can do much more good than a fabricated spirit.

August 1, 2005 @ 6:48 am | Comment

shulan,

once you were very unhappy with me saying there is no such a word as “german humor”

can you give us some examples of “german humor”?

vielen danke!

August 1, 2005 @ 6:49 am | Comment

Autsch, you got me on that Bingfeng.
You see jokes are not very welcomed her in Germany. Very hard to get a visa or a working permit. Those who made it are not very lucky. They allways get abused by people when they are drunk. So there are not so many here. Very sad. I like them, espacially the British ones.
Anyway there are some guerilla humorists who fight against the German hostility towards humor. Little sucsess till now.
Though that Germans are welcomed by people from other countrys despite their lack of humor is illustrated by the fact that it becomes more and more fashinable to Rent a German, as I allready mentioned on this site: http://rentagerman.de/

August 1, 2005 @ 7:16 am | Comment

shulan,

i tried very hard to laugh, but failed.

is that a joke, anyway?

August 1, 2005 @ 7:48 am | Comment

Don’t you get it Bingfeng? There ain’t no German jokes. Nazis killed them all.

August 1, 2005 @ 7:57 am | Comment

Kevin,

May I ask you some question? If you do have influence in UN, would you campion to remove China from securuty council seat? Which countries that you would choose for security council? Based on what?

August 1, 2005 @ 8:24 am | Comment

I would vote for Cuba. They are also Communists but have the better dancing skills. Not to mention the Cigars.

August 1, 2005 @ 8:31 am | Comment

CUBA LIBRE!

August 1, 2005 @ 8:36 am | Comment

Shulan … here’s a “German” joke … even if Germans don’t find it funny. Unfortunately, it’s a little dated now.

You know the world is upside down when:
The best golfer is black
The best rapper is white
The French are accusing the Americans of arrogance
and … the Germans don’t want to go to war.

Boom boom.

August 1, 2005 @ 8:40 am | Comment

That’ s German one? Thought it was one of those which managed to sneak through customs.
Besides Germans love this joke.

August 1, 2005 @ 8:45 am | Comment

Shulan, I agree. Dancing skill is better criteria than cleanness, even better that money contribution.

August 1, 2005 @ 8:53 am | Comment

With regards to Bing’s comments, a long way above, about China-Vietnamese conflicts …

If Bing really means everything he says in that post, then he’s provided Japanese apologists with some pretty powerful arguments. After all, the 1931 invasion of NE China was certainly NOT ordered by the Japanese high command, either civil or military. It was more in the nature of an officers’ coup. The Japanese cabinet was simply unable to confront or restrain these hot-heads … and, as such, the worst you can accuse the Japanese of, collectively speaking, is being ineffectual.

Now, I don’t think the above argument works on all levels, but if Bing believes it is a valid excuse for numerous incidents of Chinese aggression against Vietnam, then I don’t see how he/she can fail to allow the same argument to stand in relation to Japanese aggression against China.

As for the “the Vietnamese provoked us” line … there undoubtedly were elements in Chinese society actively seeking to harm Japanese interests in the region. The specific bomb (Shenyang Incident) was certainly a Japanese plant, but nevertheless, the Japanese were facing Chinese opposition / hostility. Just take a look at any of the propaganda the Chinese communists were putting out at the time. Once again, I’m not sure how good this argument really is, but if you’re going to accept Bing’s arguments in relation to Vietnam, then you’ve got to apply the same standards equally.

Funny … I hadn’t realised that Bing thinks that the Japanese invasion of Manchuria is excusable. Strikes me, you can’t have one without the other.

August 1, 2005 @ 8:54 am | Comment

Why shouldn’t China remain on the UNSC?

I mean, with Sudan on the Human Rights Council, it obviously has the people’s interests in mind. Just like China.

BTW, How many tanks does it take to clear a square in Beijing?

Only a few if you keep backing up to run over the students.

August 1, 2005 @ 9:24 am | Comment

Whether China should remains in UNSC because of Tiananmen incident in1989, I believe it deserves consideration at times. At least it makes better sense than money contribution and cleanness. As whether China should remain on UNSC in the future, well, should we prevent German joining in UNSC now because of Holocaust?

August 1, 2005 @ 9:48 am | Comment

Not a fair comparison, LW. Germany has a new government; the party that instituted the Holocaust was wiped out. In China’s case, many of the same people involved in the TSM remain in power today. Germany denounced the Holocaust and payed huge reparations. If the CCP does the same, then I would say you are making aq fair comparison.

August 1, 2005 @ 9:53 am | Comment

Germany isn’t on the UNSC.

Nuff said.

August 1, 2005 @ 9:53 am | Comment

With the exception of the United States, most of the countries on the UNSC are victims of WWII.

hmmm…..

August 1, 2005 @ 9:54 am | Comment

What concernes dancing skills, Brasil would also be a good candidat. They even seem to dance while playing football.
What concerns Germany, well …
But please you Chinese and Americans let us in. We promise to behave. Mostly.

August 1, 2005 @ 10:32 am | Comment

What concernes dancing skills, Brasil would also be a good candidat. They even seem to dance while playing football.
What concerns Germany, well …
But please you Chinese and Americans let us in. We promise to behave. Mostly.

Okay, where the hell is Brasil and what the hell is a good candidat?

August 1, 2005 @ 10:43 am | Comment

I don’t think that China has any objection for Germany to join UNSC. As for US, they might not object Germany joining UNSC. But they will think that Germany is too independent now. They know that they can always count on Japan to vote the same way as US on issues such as Iraq, but Germany? Did they just recently voice disagreement of the invasion of Iraq?

August 1, 2005 @ 11:10 am | Comment

Ähm, what about Brazil and good candidate?
And football is the game where all except two players are not allowed to touch the ball with their hands.

August 1, 2005 @ 11:35 am | Comment

Filthy Stinking No.9

You could argue in any case because you could always drop the context that couldn’t suit your purpose.

Feel free to play with your own version of my comment.

August 1, 2005 @ 11:36 am | Comment

“看不到”? “看不见”?

Martyn, 我还希望你送给我这篇文章。

Okay, that’s enough of my demonstrating my ignorance.

August 1, 2005 @ 11:37 am | Comment

seeing as it’s PLA day today let me throw in this hypothesis about the China vs Vietnam war. I read it in a book, forgotten which one. It says: maybe Deng knew that the PLA was weak and needed reform but he needed to persuade the PLA leadership of this … and didn’t have enough clout to actually order them to shake up the army and improve it.
the attack on vietnam, despite all the Chinese causalties, scared the vietnamese; China could say it to the world and its people that it penetrated Vietnam to prove a point and then withdrew of its own accord; and Deng could go to the PLA leaders and say if you lost so many people carrying out this attack, you must be pretty useless, so you should reform.
based just on the little I know about Deng this sounds very much in character. but I don’t know if the hypothesis is based on anything very substantial.

August 1, 2005 @ 11:53 am | Comment

I heart Bolton

Speaking of the death penalty, the adorable Islamic Republic of Iran administered it to two men for being homosexuals.

The moral character of the US should occasionally be considered by the enemies they keep..

August 1, 2005 @ 12:04 pm | Comment

as for the discussion about the UN security council, my belief is that it’s important some countries have a veto — otherwise the UN would fall apart.
it would otherwise fall apart because if, say, a 66% majority was required to put a resolution through, people would be constantly pissing each other off: some countries would be on the losing side of votes most of the time and walk out of the UN as a result.
so some countries must have a veto. but if too many countries have a veto then the impact and import of a veto is diluted, everybody starts bandying them around or threatening to use them just for revenge.
so you limit the veto to, say, 5 countries.
now yes it’s tough if, because of the way things are, you’re one of the majority of countries that doesn’t have a veto.
but life isn’t fair and instead you must rely on what every diplomatic effort in the world relies upon which is cultivating friends and alliances.
so if enough small countries want something blocked they can lobby a UNSC permanent member to threaten a veto. a large non-UNSC country can lobby an ally or friend independently.
and so you have a system which lurches and jolts and judders along, admittedly, but which most countries belong to and in practise — if not in principle — accept.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:08 pm | Comment

And you know something, Johnny? What we just saw in Iran will soon become business as usual in its twin sister Iraq. We will give them the tools to choose their own government, and they will almost certainly choose a theocracy that is hostile to women, eliminationist toward Israel and Jews and gays, anti-USA and downright dangerous. That to me is the ultimate folly of our dirty little war. Even the “victory” (i.e., freedom and democracy) will end up hurting us. It’s a pure lose-lose situation, and we should have known it before we got stuck.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:13 pm | Comment

and reasons why the current 5 are good:

the US: big country; most powerful; got nukes; very large sphere of influence and intent to use that influence.

Russia: big country; got nukes; large sphere of influence and desire to use that influence.

China: big country; got nukes; growing sphere of influence and willingness to take the lead in its region.

France: big ego; got nukes; reasonable sphere of influence in Europe and Africa; it’s always good to have a contrarian on board.

Britain: *Great* Britain; got a few nukes; all-round good eggs who can be relied upon to beat the French and help the Americans understand what it takes to run the world.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:20 pm | Comment

doubtless this thread is shortly closing and my considered opinions shall shortly be consigned to the big Peking Duck in the sky, so let me roar out in partriotic fervour:

WHEN Britain first at Heaven’s command
Arose from out the azure main,
This was the charter of her land,
And guardian angels sung the strain:

August 1, 2005 @ 12:25 pm | Comment

Thread won’t close until this afternoon, at least another couple of hours…but it’s definitely on its last leg.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:30 pm | Comment

Part of an Alleged Prose in North Korean Primary School Textbook:

Granddad King (Kim Jong Il) spoke to Young Pioneers sincerely: “The people of America and Europe, long for basking in the shine of Juche (principal) Idea. However, big capitalists forbid them from learning Juche Idea. They can only read newspapers to know the great achievement of North Korea in Juche Idea. The world is yours and you should be diligent in studies to give the people in America and Europe a chance to learn freely the Juche Idea as soon as possible.”

Granddad King apologised to Young Pioneers: “I was too busy in work this month because the world peace relies on us. How could we abandon the people of other countries? Bush, the chief capitalist of America, resorted to us for support to continue suppressing American people. How could we agree? But Bush, the chief capitalist still got aid from the Japanese Imperial Henchman and once again suppressed the uprising led by Kerry. Having committed such atrocity, Bush and his cronies will not be forgiven by the people all over the world.”

August 1, 2005 @ 12:37 pm | Comment

Don’t know if it’s true or not.

Just for fun, translated two paragraphs from Chinese.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:39 pm | Comment

but you know, Japan and North Korea are good friends too:
Pyongyang, July 29 (KCNA) — Leader Kim Jong Il was presented with a floral basket by the first Japanese delegation for the study of the Juche idea on a visit to the DPRK. It was handed to an official concerned by Yoshio Suzuki, president of the Hokkaido Society for the Study of Kim Jong Il Works, who is leading the delegation.

August 1, 2005 @ 12:43 pm | Comment

“But they will think that Germany is too independent now. They know that they can always count on Japan to vote the same way as US on issues such as Iraq.”

So, you think Japan is sincere with Uncle Sam? Lol. One month after the US backing of UNSC seat is proven useless, Japan slapped trade sanctions on US.

“The Japanese government has decided that there is a need to more effectively pressure the US by implementing retaliatory measures and promoting the repeal of the amendment,” said Trade Minister Shoichi Nakagawa.

“Our country decided today to launch a countermeasure from 1 September over the Byrd Amendment.”

Japan will place levies on US steel products such as ball bearings and airplane parts, and the cost of the action could run to as much as 5.7bn yen (£29m; $51m), the trade ministry said.

Lol, again.

August 1, 2005 @ 1:26 pm | Comment

freedom: imposing such trade sanctions doesn’t mean Japan would vote against the US on something like Iraq. britain almost got into a minor trade war with the US a year or two ago, and look what Britain did in Iraq!

August 1, 2005 @ 1:34 pm | Comment

.. so no need to “lo” quite so “l” !

August 1, 2005 @ 1:39 pm | Comment

WHEN Britain first at Heaven’s command
Arose from out the azure main,
This was the charter of her land,
And guardian angels sung the strain:

No Goal

August 1, 2005 @ 2:47 pm | Comment

shulan doesn’t “think it’s all over .. IT IS NOW!!!”
I liked your bomb dialogue however. but I don’t think you give enough credit to the Russian linesman who made it all possible.

August 1, 2005 @ 4:23 pm | Comment

It was only a matter of time — now I’m closing this bloated thread. A new one has been opened above. (New threads are usually started in the late afternoon, Mountain time.)

August 1, 2005 @ 4:35 pm | Comment

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